- October 24, 2013 at 3:16 am #111214
I found fellow travelers to be a distraction – till a friend of mine opened my eye to ’em. This is one of the images I captured with the newly opened eye sometime back, actively looking for people to add to the frame. Please critique.
EXIF: 1/640;f/5.6;18mm;Exposure bias: -0.3
- October 24, 2013 at 8:58 am #111225
Ravi I cannot offer constructive criticism because this is not my type of photo. That said I will offer this: It is a very interesting perspective that you have taken here. Your eye looking up at the structure (is it a temple) without ground or walkways yet including the people does add some idea of the hinted size of what we are looking at.
- October 24, 2013 at 12:25 pm #111246JonathanParticipant
Terrible composition, halo artifacts around the edge of the building, and appear to have been taken under mid-day sun which has resulted in excessively harsh shadows and flat colour.
- October 24, 2013 at 2:40 pm #111284P MarioneBlocked
I found fellow travelers to be a distraction – till a friend of mine opened my eye to ‘em. This is one of the images I captured with the newly opened eye sometime back, actively looking for people to add to the frame.
I don’t understand a word of that philosophical gibberish but what I see is a very bad travel picture : people feet are cut, the temple is lost in the middle, bad lighting… 🙁
- October 24, 2013 at 8:30 pm #111314
That’s fine @nikon-nut – if you could tell more as to why you think this photo is no good that will help.
This is the grandest and the most beautiful of all the temples in Khajuraho, India. The name is Kandariya Mahadev built in 1030AD and the tower is more than 100ft long on a 7feet platform.
- October 24, 2013 at 8:33 pm #111315
@jonathantimar : It was taken under mid-day sun sure and so the harsh shadows and flat colour.
Are you sure about the halo artifacts? I tried on two different monitors but don’t see any. Has it got anything to do with colour settings on computer monitors?
It will be helpful if you could tell why you think it is a terrible composition. Thanks.
- October 24, 2013 at 8:39 pm #111316
If you have anything worthwhile to say about the photo and why you think it is ‘a very bad travel picture’ it might be of some help.
- October 25, 2013 at 3:48 am #111327P MarioneBlocked
As I said the people feet and legs are cut, lighting is too harsh, the temple which is the subject occupy a fourth of the space and is tilted. Looks like a pic taken by a tourist on his iphone…
- October 25, 2013 at 7:44 am #111340
Ravi I am sorry but I have to agree with the others here. I said the composition was interesting but that does not mean good in this instance. I have a feeling that you composed this image like this to overcome some elements that you did not want to include in the photo. To be honest, considering some of your previous images, I am surprised that you posted this.
- October 25, 2013 at 8:45 pm #111398Fred FurzeParticipant
I don’t agree with the comments above about this being a terrible composition. I actually like the concept a lot. I think it would have helped to have a very thin sliver of the ground at the bottom of the frame, or to see the people’s feet standing on the bottom of the frame. Maybe also crop the photo so that the temple is not so dead-center. Aside from that I like it.
- October 25, 2013 at 10:29 pm #111400Dru Stefan StoneParticipant
In the category of travel photograph, it begs the asking, would I want to go see this? If we can answer with a resounding yes! I want to be there tomorrow or I can’t wait to see this, where is this? then it is a success.
For me though I wonder where the rest of the photograph is. I know it is cut off on the bottom because I only see parts of people, there is more there. The perspective and composition in terms of positioning and negative space I like, but that is where it ends for me. I want to see the whole temple and the entire body of the people included, because I know they are there. The photograph also looks very flat, there is little depth of field, probably because of focal length, which bothers me a bit. So as a travel photograph for personal use yes, but probably not so much for travel brochures or enticing people to want to go there.
- October 26, 2013 at 8:57 pm #111476
@nikon-nut – the temple is on an elevated feet platform which is of no interest and that’s what I was trying to avoid.
I post images on shark tank to get bitten about those images I was doubtful about – I expect all kinds of criticism and have no problems about it because I am not perfect and believe learning is a journey.
Even when the criticism is not very objective, it doesn’t matter because I simply ignore it and move on.
- October 26, 2013 at 9:29 pm #111479
@drus – that’s an interesting perspective you have. I agree with you and especially about the shutter speed-f stop choice I made. I think I was not thinking much about that and was focusing on the composition (I know that sounds lame) – I was carrying a new camera and wasn’t yet comfortable with its controls.
The photograph is not cut off – the temple tower is 100ft long on a 7 ft platform which is about 20 ft wide for the visitors to go round and see and appreciate. If you want to look at it from some distance, you got to get off the platform (like I did). I have another one with a part of the platform captured in the second photograph.
Anything you photograph from the platform will have to be details (with perspective correction) or the whole structure – see the 3rd photograph.
I wouldn’t know why they wouldn’t have a wider platform, why they don’t allow tripods (this is such a ridiculous rule), why this place is photographer unfriendly.
- October 26, 2013 at 9:36 pm #111485
Thanks. Like I said elsewhere in the thread, when one gets off the platform, one can still see the people not their feet 🙂
I too don’t like to place subjects bang in the centre but I don’t consider it a rule and play around a bit sometimes.
- October 27, 2013 at 2:05 am #111497kelvin espadaParticipant
The image makes me feel like it’s incomplete, like there is something missing. The angle is interesting but the image tells me nothing. I just simply don’t like the composition. Perhaps a wide angle with something in the foreground giving the scene some reference.
- October 27, 2013 at 2:42 am #111498
What should an image tell you? Its not supposed to document anything – the image is my impression of what I saw, this is not a sponsored documentation. (given that I didn’t pay attention to exposure).
It seems you neither read my brief nor the others’ comments. I used a 18mm (I guess we can call that wide angle and if you had ever been to that place, you will know that there is nothing in front of it and I wouldn’t want to place anything in front of the beautiful monument either.
When it comes to art, we better trust our own inner voice and ignore what world wants – some of the images might not turn out to be appealing but that’s how life is.
- October 27, 2013 at 2:50 am #111499kelvin espadaParticipant
Wow! Ok, sorry for the response.
- October 27, 2013 at 2:50 am #111500
@drus – I forgot mentioning that I am an amateur. Why would I shoot to market the monument? that’s not what I want to do and I don’t care if people would want to go there when they see my image. All I was doing is what my inner voice told me is the right thing to do.
“Your only obligation in any lifetime is to be true to yourself. Being true to anyone else or anything else is not only impossible, but the mark of a fake messiah” ~ Richard Bach
- October 27, 2013 at 7:49 am #111536
Ravi your later photos have much more information in them than the original. With respect to the original I believe you are defending the indefensible. I made a comment to another poster about their pic. I said that we are not going to say his pic is good if it isn’t. Likewise we are not going to tell you something is bad if it isn’t.
In one of my very first submissions here I posted a pic that I thought was fairly good and had merit. I was bludgeoned for it. Everyone tore it apart. Ravi I was devastated and I was hurt. I made no further comments or rebuttals for that pic but here is what I did do. I went back that and reread all of the comments over and over and soon realized just what I am telling you. I came to the realization that what I was presenting was not going to have public acceptance. So I abandon that sort of photo and pp. I had arrogantly thought that I had come across a photo method that had been heretofore undiscovered. What I did discover was that I was hanging my hat on crap. It had probably been discovered many times but found wanting.
Just because I like something does not mean anyone else will. We all want others to like and praise our work It is something that is inherent with us. If you like it fine but you cannot make the world like it just by saying that it is better than it is.
But by all means keep shooting my friend. Do not stop…
- October 27, 2013 at 2:10 pm #111579Colyn SerfonteinParticipant
From the posts above and the author’s responses I have to wonder. Were these images posted to get some real feedback or give the author the opportunity to validate some really bad shots.
These shots will fail miserably as Travel shots in any competition.
The bad crops, poor composition and harsh light places them in the “happy snappy” category.
Others have mentioned it … for a shot to be considered good Travel photography it must tell you a story of a place, people or scenery and it must be composed and shot in way that males the viewer want to get on a bus and go visit.
These shots have no message of a place or of people.
- October 27, 2013 at 3:00 pm #111585Rob Wood (Admin)Keymaster
From a purely technical point of view @raviputcha , there are two long standing conventions that this photograph breaks.
Haloing around the building.
Both are generally regarded as negative things, but if it’s what you were trying to achieve, then there is no problems. As you can see, my opinion on converging verticals is quite different to the general consensus and I still make no apologies for it. Neither should you if that’s what you like.
- October 27, 2013 at 4:00 pm #111594VeronikaParticipant
How about a few suggestions:
Go back there, if you can, either at dawn or dusk for more intersting lighting. Maybe there will be fewer people there at that time of day.
Is it lit up at night?
Maybe you can use a tripod from a farther distance?
Make sure your horizon line is straight.
- October 28, 2013 at 12:48 am #111643
@veronikac – other than going back there, none of what you suggested are possible because, after dusk (actually before dusk) the place is closed, no tripods are allowed and the platform around the tower is so unsafe that if you trip over the edge the fall can be fatal.
The second and third photos are taken at dusk.
- October 28, 2013 at 12:52 am #111646
- October 28, 2013 at 1:17 am #111647
@colyn – A bad image is a bad image – I am not trying to prove that these pictures are not bad – just want to know why they are. I don’t need anyone’s validation nor care for any. That doesn’t mean that I take all feedback as it is without a question or argument…both questions and arguments are healthy. I argue and question not because I don’t like anyone’s critique but because I want to have a deeper more meaningful discussion – not superficial judgements (I don’t need them – like I said, I am not competing, I don’t aim to earn any money out of photography).
Your outrage with my questioning is obvious and that doesn’t affect me. I shoot because I like to shoot, if an image turns out to be bad, I loose nothing, far from it.
- October 28, 2013 at 1:25 am #111648
@admin thanks! I guess you are talking about the halo in the 3rd photograph (I don’t see a halo around the first one like someone else pointed out) and it doesn’t look right to me too.
Coming to the topic of converging verticals: Your article is a good one. I got to mention the unique challenges this place (Khajuraho, India) poses for photography. The height, poorly thought out platform built around the ancient temple, timings of the visit, unfriendly rules make it challenging.
I would love to go back there and try fixing my mistakes – perhaps I haven’t explored enough, there are ways to overcome these hurdles.
- October 28, 2013 at 1:42 am #111649
@nikon-nut – let me say it again: I don’t post a photo here for appreciation. You feel like bludgeon a photo, do it by all means – it doesn’t hurt me, I know it’s not personal. I am not trying to make people like it either – I don’t need to.
I like a deep and heated discussions and arguments (some of these end up in verbal fights) – this grunge makes us feel fresh, clear in our mind and strong – don’t you think so? corollary to this: superficial, shallow, angry judgements – they are useless and deserve to be pointed out.
You got it right – sometimes we hang our hats on crap and honest and thoughtful feedback helps. I liked these photos but I now see the points many of you made. This deserves serious thought on how to make good of the hurdles Khajuraho has for photography. Sometime soon I will go back there, this time with better planning.
- October 28, 2013 at 4:18 am #111655Lenny WollitzParticipant
I like 4613-2, the middle one. The people on the right could be removed but I like the guy on the left as he gives me and idea how big the temple is. Could you fix the lean to the left? The one on the top… too many people and some are cut off. The one on the bottom… no people, no scale.
Regarding amateurs vs. professionals. I find some of the individual pros comments here to be the same over and over probably because that may be their “style” and they may be in a rut, hopefully profitable but still in a rut. Easy to do when one has deadlines and needs to process tons of photos to buy groceries or pay the rent. On the other hand some of the amateurs, including myself I’m sure, are way out in left field but sometimes have an interesting view. Sometimes I will spend hours with one photo, think it looks pretty good and post it here, and in two minutes someone with a well developed eye like @pmarione will post a cryptic one liner and I say to myself, “crap, why didn’t I see that?” But, next time I will! I think it’s great to brush elbows with both!
- October 29, 2013 at 3:23 pm #111816JonathanParticipant
Sorry @raviputcha, I was having a bit of an off day and my original comments were rude. I apologize.
I can’t tell you why it’s a bad composition, it’s just my opinion.
As for the halo artifacts, I can’t be sure on that either. It may well be a natural part of the photo. I know it’s not my screen.
The second photo you posted (which I don’t think was there when I commented originally) is better. At least there the people have something to walk on and aren’t just floating on the edge of the frame.
- October 29, 2013 at 6:58 pm #111834Dwaine GipeParticipant
“….there are ways to overcome “. Amen. I see a ton of interesting parts each of which could be a story into it’s self. Based on what I can see the structure would be most difficult to capture standing alone, in my opinion. Is there a curio shop where other’s photographic work might be studied? Could the natives and or tourists become an interesting part of the total story? I might consider the parts becoming support to the total image. I love a challenge and sometimes submit to torture while ending up with nothing yet I believe the difficult trips were worth their weight in gold. At least “sometimes” I learn where not to go in the future.
- October 29, 2013 at 8:47 pm #111836
@docgipe Right, some places are just difficult for photographers. Its easy for those who don’t know about the place to bludgeon a photograph but the challenges are for real. it is really hard for the monuments in Khajuraho to be photographed.
Yes the photographers commissioned by the ASI (the authority which manages the heritage structures in India) have all facilities to take better photos – with mega step ladders, tripods etc. Visitors can’t even take a tripod in.
I will go back there for sure (its 12 hrs by train from where I am) and take the challenge again – perhaps try a new perspective, but the ghastly platform, long towers are for real and they screw up the perspective – there is no way you can beat the physics. I will try anyway because the as real as the challenges are the sheer magnificence of Khajuraho temples is really real and unparalleled.
- October 29, 2013 at 9:31 pm #111841
Sorry but I have to agree with the others, the pics are not very good. I think the biggest problem is because the lower part is cut out it feels as if there something missing, that you are only looking at a small part of the monument? The third one is better but because its off centre it feel anoying to me
- October 31, 2013 at 9:43 am #111962Dru Stefan StoneParticipant
The reason I commented about “marketing” or the idea of people wanting to go to the monument had to do with titling it a “travel photograph.” It seems more of a misunderstanding to intent rather than critique. Travel Photographs typically are photographs to inspire visits or intrigue about a culture. My mistake.
- October 31, 2013 at 10:00 am #111964
- October 31, 2013 at 1:11 pm #111998
Gee for some one who apparently feels that “No, criticism can’t get me – appreciation doesn’t get to my head either. I’m kind of detached in these matters” you sure seem to be very sensitive…
If something in an image is anoying to the eye then it warrants a criticism. The fact it is off centre IS annoying and distracting to me and hence a criticism. I have also told you that ”
because the lower part is cut out it feels as if there something missing”
Jonathan posts “I can’t tell you why it’s a bad composition, it’s just my opinion.” yet I tell you that the image is annoying due to being off centre and you single me out as and criticise me as being lazy…lol
If you are going to start discussing lazy I could start on how you approached taking your photos but alas…
- October 31, 2013 at 9:27 pm #112035
One more thing…here are some other comments posted about your pics:
“composition was interesting but that does not mean good ”
“what I see is a very bad travel picture”
“Looks like a pic taken by a tourist on his iphone”
“I just simply don’t like the composition”
“you are defending the indefensible”
“These shots will fail miserably”
And yet you single me out and have a big cry (even though apparently you can handle criticism lol) for merely saying the shot being off centre was annoying…?
You are a strange person….and not a very good photographer
- November 4, 2013 at 4:27 am #112264Lee ReedParticipant
Most of us just know that things do not float in space with no attachment to anything else. As a result, when we an image we want to see how it connects to other things. This is what your images lack; a feeling of context. This can be a huge challenge in photography as it is not always easy to include context in a meaningful way, and yet many times when executed properly, marrying context with the rest of the composition can be a source of great power in your images.The key to great photography is to eliminate everything that is not absolutely necessary in the image, while not leaving out anything that is needed. These images are a good start, but you need to work on giving them a world in which to exist instead of leaving them to float aimlessly in space.
- November 4, 2013 at 8:33 am #112272Natasha NataleParticipant
Of the three you posted I like the second one best. The first one looks cut off, and the composition in the third is a bit boring.
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